460 street engine build

[OldRedFord]

First....get the DOVE heads. Really good in stock form, better ported. You wont be disapointed. If you are, give them to me. Please? D3's have potential too. They will support 400 hp from what Ive read. DOVE's are good to 500 ponies, with full on port work and larger valves. Just to give you an idiea for the worth of the DOVE's....I was told $400 for a pair mildly worked.

The only difference between the 460 and 429 is the stroke. The bores are the same at 4.36" The 429 has a 3.9" stroke where the 460 has a 3.85" stroke.

What are the block casting numbers?

The 429 will still be a 460 block, but like said above, different stroke. (I belive the block #s are the same, correct me if Im wrong)

The particular block Im running is a DIVE block. Internally balanced crank. Guys are taking the blocks .030 over a lot of times, allowing CI's of 545 from a stock block. Some have even gone .080 over. There are also DOVE casting blocks, they can be 4 bolt mains from the factory. Also all the block as far as i know can be converted to 4 bolt mains if you want.

Both the 460 and 429 will handle stupid abuse. But I am partial to the 460.

Im not sure what cam you would be looking at. I think head work would be required to see any gains from a tunnel ram.

Let me know if I can help you out any way.

[BobbyFord]

Scotty Johnston ports D0VE heads out of Tacoma, WA. Has gotten 700 HP from properly ported D0VE heads and the correct ancilliary components.
I would stay away from the tunnel ram and opt for a Weiand Stealth dual plane intake. 750 cfm carb is on the small side for a built 460.

[BobbyFord]

I guess the "tunnel ram" and the "best heads" part threw me off, too.
FWIW, a pre-'72, stock 429 Thunderjet was rated at 360 HP.

[averagef250]

The purpose of the tunnel ram is looks and the ability to run an air cleaner. With an iron intake the current carb is right under the hood, there's no room for an air cleaner. I don't want to cut the hood just to stick the air cleaner through, I'd rather have the whole carb above the hood. As far as heads go if the non-adjustable D3's will do it that's fine with me. I didn't mean to imply I wanted the "best" heads. I just asked if DOVE-C's were worthwhile or if something else would be worth holding out for.

The car is just a cruiser/joyride vehicle. It just needs to light the tires, sound mean and embarass a honda now and then.

[BobbyFord]

Lack of cam, smallish carb and the long runners of a tunnel ram is not a good combo. For grunt you'll wanna ditch the ram and run a dual plane intake. T-rams are designed for engines running over 5500 rpm's. Go with a Stealth, a nice 5500 cam, some good headers (mufflers,etc.), roller rockers, 9.5-10:1 compression and you'll be pleasantly surprised.

[averagef250]

Have you ever driven anything with a single 4 tunnel ram? They aren't that bad, actually work pretty good. They have really long runners, longer than a dual plane (the purpose of the dual plane is to increase the runner length over a single plane intake). I've never had anyone tell me a single 4 tunnel ram wouldn't work on the street before.

[BobbyFord]

I disagree. Dual plane is designed for horsepower throughout an overall lower powerband. Single plane intakes rob from the lower end rpm's and are designed for higher rpm ranges. Single plane intakes are also not as efficient on heavy vehicles.
I have driven a single tunnel ram car. It was a gutted, tubbed 67 Camaro with a trans-braked powerglide.

[OldRedFord]

I wonder how the ports would line up?

[averagef250]

Thanks for the link. The 400-425 HP combination is right up my alley. Tossing the tunnel ram idea out for now, anyone know where I can buy a low profile carb hat with intake tubes like the old thunderbolts had? I'm considering removing the inner two headlights and plumbing intake tubes to a carb hat if I can find such a thing.

I tried to get the 750HP holley to run on the current engine yesterday. Not happening. The carb had HUGE 73/84 jets and 31 squirters. Enough fuel to kill the engine instantly when the secondaries opened. Went down to 67/72's with improvement, but much more tuning needed, probably not worth the time. I'll just put another engine together.

[fomocoguy]

Thanks for the link. The 400-425 HP combination is right up my alley. Tossing the tunnel ram idea out for now, anyone know where I can buy a low profile carb hat with intake tubes like the old thunderbolts had? I'm considering removing the inner two headlights and plumbing intake tubes to a carb hat if I can find such a thing.

I tried to get the 750HP holley to run on the current engine yesterday. Not happening. The carb had HUGE 73/84 jets and 31 squirters. Enough fuel to kill the engine instantly when the secondaries opened. Went down to 67/72's with improvement, but much more tuning needed, probably not worth the time. I'll just put another engine together.

Yeah, a 650 cfm carb will be plenty for it. The 400-425hp outline they've got calls for a 650 if I'm not mistaken. When it comes to 460's there really is a "less is more" rule. The main thing is the heads. Without any porting or bigger valves they flow like crap. There is a sharp turn in the exhaust port that kills power big time. You will never get to where you want to be without some work in that department. The combination of bigger valves and porting is crucial, and you will also need to get the cr up. That's where DOVE heads can help; they are closed chamber and will provide for a higher cr. If you go over to the site I mentioned the first thing they will tell you is "HEADS HEADS HEADS!!!" They have a for sale section there, and a few months ago a reputable site member was going to sell me a set of rebuilt, ported and polished DOVE's with bigger valves for $500, which is about half what it would cost at a machine shop. He may still have them...

BTW you could probably modify a carb hat from a early 70's Lincoln w/ a 460. They are pretty low profile and were all factory 4 barrels.

[averagef250]

The 400-425 outline is a holley 750DP, RPM intake, ported DOVE heads with stock valves, 9.5:1 cr, comp 262H cam and a 6000 RPM redline.

I have a fresh, never fired, supposedly "built" (performer intake) early 429 that was owned by a friends father in law that passed away. The engine sat outside, uncovered and is now locked up. I plan to pull those heads and see where they stand.

Great tip on the lincoln 460 carb hats. I'm really suprised they put 460's in these cars factory, they really don't fit very well.

[BobbyFord]

My freshly built 460 is going to need 850-900 CFM carb. It is a .020 over D1VE block, max-ported D0VE heads with larger valves, Comp stainless steel roller rockers, Blue Thunder valve covers, ported Stealth dual-plane intake, re-curved Duraspark dist., flat top forged Speed Pro pistons (11.3:1), football truck rods, 571 lift solid flat tappet Engle cam, HV oil pump. I was gonna stick it in my '63 Uni but I'm prolly gonna stick it in my '72 short bed. I have a car trans to match the 460 but I need to swap out the tailshafts and housings for the bolt on driveshaft.

[averagef250]

Per holley, a 460 at 6000 RPM at 100% VE uses 750 CFM. 100% VE isn't very likely.

[BobbyFord]

The info from Holley is for a stock application. Not max ported heads and larger valves. My heads have the larger valves installed and I have a much higher lift than stock camshaft. I'm just going by what the engine builders at 460ford.com told me. They all said 750 was too small for my application.

[averagef250]

May be true, I think people tune differently. I tend to like a smaller carb than the largest thing I can put on there. I like to keep compression on the low side and gear a little high. I like the smell of race fuel, but don't like paying for it. You cannot run over 10:1 on the street with iron heads anymore. The last gasoline engine I put money into to go fast was a 7500 RPM small block that ran 11.2:1 on the street with iron heads and 91 octane. I thought I could get away with that compression if I ran a radical camshaft and set the pistons for rediculously tight quench. The engine had a hard life, got alot of miles out of it, but in the end a ring land came apart at 7000+. The rod bearings all had visible lines in them from pinging, but I never once actually heard the engine ping. I was wrong and don't feel CR is that important to make big power anymore.

The specs from Holley are not for stock VS built engines. They're scientific and relate directly to the volumetric efficiency of an engine. An all out race engine actually can have 100% VE or even a little better with extremely well designed exhaust systems. A stock smog 460 is running in the 60% VE on a good day.